segurity: looking for feedback, etc..

[pt]

hiya, i started to write an article about security of the segway and securing it.

here's a first draft, if anyone has some ideas / suggestions please post them up here. the final article will be released in a week or so, i need to do some more reviews of locks and a couple other things.

article here:
http://www.bookofseg.com/secure.html

cheers,
pt

http://www.bookofseg.com

[Brooster]

Looks like you're off to a great start PT ... I like the pictures.

Brooster

[4Seg]

pt, Great work. I just realized something. (Thanks to your video of the installation)
As you demonstrated how easy assembly is; I found a big gotcha, the control shaft.
All so true about the 64-bit key; however, give me an allen wrench and about 10 seconds and you're not going anywhere either. This is bad news and I didn't realize it until now.

Theifs are one thing, pranksters are another. Is there a plastic cap to cover/hide the control shaft bolt?



If we could only be resellers...

Mike
http://www.stlsegway.com
Yahoo: stlsegway

[BruceWright]

Great info and images... a good survey of techniques and common-sense. I especially like the part about breaking up your routine so that a thief doesn't target you.

I love the locks you show. They look really nice with the Segway, I'd trust em!

[pt]

bad news? naa, you can only do so much in life, at some point you won't leave the house (well, maybe to stock up on more ammo). people can take apart bikes, cars, buildings...i guess you could put a little cap over the bolt, but if you follow common sense guidelines, i don't think theft will be a problem for the segway, at least more than anything other type of theft.

cheers,
pt

quote:Originally posted by 4Segway

pt, Great work. I just realized something. (Thanks to your video of the installation) As you demonstrated how easy assembly is; I found a big gotcha, the control shaft. All so true about the 64-bit key; however, give me an allen wrench and about 10 seconds and you're not going anywhere either. This is bad news and I didn't realize it until now. Theifs are one thing, pranksters are another. Is there a plastic cap to cover/hide the control shaft bolt?


http://www.bookofseg.com

[GlideMaster]

Hi pt, great pictures on the security issue. I sent the Krypto people an e-mail a while back asking if they might be developing a U shaped Kryptonite lock that would fit through the Segway security hole, but never got a reply. I let them know that I was aware of the cable type that was being sold by Segway LLC. Enjoy The Glide

<center>Ahhh The World of Seg, and a good world it is.

Have Seg Will Travel

REMEMBER:
Responsible Riders Ride Segway
and
Segway Riders Ride Responsibly

Segway, The Mind Changer</center>





quote:Originally posted by pt

hiya, i started to write an article about security of the segway and securing it.

here's a first draft, if anyone has some ideas / suggestions please post them up here. the final article will be released in a week or so, i need to do some more reviews of locks and a couple other things.

article here:
http://www.bookofseg.com/secure.html

cheers,
pt

http://www.bookofseg.com

[axiotek]

pt -

One question about transitioning between keys, if you have started a trip with the yellow key and then come to a pedestrian environment can you "shift down" to the black key while in motion without stopping and restarting or reinitializing?

Thanks for the security article, by the way.

[bicycledriver]

pt - question about using just a U-lock on the handlebar shaft. Can the handlebars be removed by a thief in a hurry? Or is the handlebar secure enough that the wheel lock isn't needed?

Thanks,
Steve Goodridge
http://www.humantransport.org/bicycledriving/library/parking/parkingcommercial.htm

[bicycledriver]

The standard U-lock was designed small enough to be able to work with a parking meter. Cable locks don't work with standard meters. Below is a picture of an *enhanced* parking meter post designed to accept a chain or cable lock.

http://www.humantransport.org/bicycledriving/library/parking/parkingmeterenhanced.jpg

If one were to try to lock a Segway to this loop using the cable lock provided by Segway LLC, how low would the loop on the pole need to be to get the cable through? I can use this information to recommend a better design to work for Segways.

Steve Goodridge

[jgrohol]

No, you have to stop the unit, dismount, turn it off, and restart it with the new key. You cannot change keys while the unit is on.

(BTW, the keys really are keys. From Webster's definition of a key, "a means of gaining or preventing entrance, possession, or control.")

You should always use the locking hole through the wheel and fender in order to secure your Segway while not in use in a public location. Simply locking it to the handlebar shaft is not as secure.

[axiotek]

quote:Originally posted by jgrohol

No, you have to stop the unit, dismount, turn it off, and restart it with the new key. You cannot change keys while the unit is on.


Thanks jgrohol, that's what I thought, but just wanted to make sure. It would be very cool if you could change mid-motion however, but this is, I bet, fundamental to the design.

[pt]

my plan is to use both, a cable / chain lock and a ulock around the handlebar shaft. i'll have picutres later.

there will be people here that will say "uh, well- they can take the unit apart, blah, blah" at that point it's over anyway if someone is that motivated, most security experts say thieves will avoid ulocks and chain locks when used together.

cheers,
pt

quote:Originally posted by bicycledriver

pt - question about using just a U-lock on the handlebar shaft. Can the handlebars be removed by a thief in a hurry? Or is the handlebar secure enough that the wheel lock isn't needed?

http://www.bookofseg.com

[bicycledriver]

quote:Originally posted by jgrohol


You should always use the locking hole through the wheel and fender in order to secure your Segway while not in use in a public location. Simply locking it to the handlebar shaft is not as secure.


I wonder why they didn't design the locking hole to accept a U-lock.

I have had bike thieves cut through a medium thickness cable lock and a medium chain lock. The only chains that are thick enough to make me feel secure about them are too heavy for my preference when bicycling, but may be acceptable on a motorized vehicle. Nobody has touched my U-locks.

I now use a custom-combination U-lock wherever I go - I don't have to worry about bringing the key, but I do have to make sure to obscure the combination from view when I open the lock. Previously I used a keyed U-lock with one key affixed to a retracting cord on my CamelBak and a spare on my house keychain.

Steve Goodridge

[GlideMaster]

The wheels on the i167 that I glide on has five good size cutouts on the wheel and one small (9/10" or almost 3/4") hole for a security lock or cable. The security hole goes through the wheel and the fender without any blockage once they are aligned properly. The large holes are primarily blocked by the fender and the gear box behind that. The fender has no holes on it except for the 6 screw holes that attach the fender to the gearbox and the one security hole. You cannot run the U lock through the wheel and the fender because the width of the U lock IS NOT WIDE ENOUGH... The distance between the two parallel legs of the U must be at least 4 inches more than the radius of the wheel due to the tire and the fender sloping over the tire. Hope you understand what I'm trying to explain without your having a Segway next to you. I would guess maybe a total of about 10 inches would be needed in the bottom of the U to maneuver the lock around. Enjoy The Glide

<center>Ahhh The World of Seg, and a good world it is.

Have Seg Will Travel

REMEMBER:
Responsible Riders Ride Segway
and
Segway Riders Ride Responsibly

Segway, The Mind Changer</center>









quote:Originally posted by bicycledriver

quote:Originally posted by jgrohol


You should always use the locking hole through the wheel and fender in order to secure your Segway while not in use in a public location. Simply locking it to the handlebar shaft is not as secure.


I wonder why they didn't design the locking hole to accept a U-lock.

I have had bike thieves cut through a medium thickness cable lock and a medium chain lock. The only chains that are thick enough to make me feel secure about them are too heavy for my preference when bicycling, but may be acceptable on a motorized vehicle. Nobody has touched my U-locks.

I now use a custom-combination U-lock wherever I go - I don't have to worry about bringing the key, but I do have to make sure to obscure the combination from view when I open the lock. Previously I used a keyed U-lock with one key affixed to a retracting cord on my CamelBak and a spare on my house keychain.

Steve Goodridge

[JosephM]

That's great PT. Keep up the good work and make more videos for us!! :D !

Visit our FIRST Help Boards at http://tucker.helix-designs.com//index.php !!

[cosmo]

PT - How are the security mechanisms working out after 60+ days?
Are you still using the ulock, chain lock, and sensor alarm mentioned in you article? http://www.bookofseg.com/secure.html

Any other owners have experience\suggestions you would like to share?

I'm sure many of us are starting to think more seriously about security with the anticipation of our Segway deliveries...Thanks!

-cosmo-
Segway Pix Fix:
http://www.segwaychat.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=767

[pt]

quote:Originally posted by cosmo PT - How are the security mechanisms working out after 60+ days? Are you still using the ulock, chain lock, and sensor alarm mentioned in you article?

everything is still working out great, cable lock and ulock are used still, the motion sensor i don't use that often, but i keep it with me at all times. i've not had a theft, or even an attempt and i think i've left the ht in a wide variety of areas and settings.

overall, it's all common sense-- if folks read the article and know their area, they won't have any problems.

cheers,
pt

http://www.bookofseg.com