Turning speed vs. forward speed

[terryp]

I sent the following to one of our trainers at Segway, and will post his reply. In the meantime, I'd like to know how users feel.
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...There's something that has been bugging me lately concerning the turning sensitivity of the HT. You showed us how much more sensitive it is to turning as you go from the black to the yellow and red keys, and mentioned that on the red key we probably won't need to turn the grip past 11 or 1 oclock. That's what's bothering me. At low speeds (black key), you can afford to make sharper turns without tipping over, yet at high speeds (red key), a slight over-rotation of the grip could result in an accident. Why isn't the turning sensitivity highest with the black key and lowest with the red? Then you could have the full range of rotation to work with on all three keys...

'One eight inch step for a man, one giant lean for mankind'

[Stan671]

I know what you mean. I like the top speed of the red key, but I would prefer the steering be less sensitive. The twist grip is a bit too jumpy for me in red mode.

Actually, this brings to mind someone else's comments that he prefers to keep it in red mode all the time, even when indoors. This is because then he does not have to re-learn, so to speak, the sensitivity of the steering control as he changes keys.

And now that I think about it, I kind of agree. When I use the black key indoors and have to turn the grip a long way around for a certain speed spin, and then go outside and load the red key, I have to use a different set of twist grip actions for turning now. This seems to be confusing me.

Stan Dobrowski

[pt]

i think once you use the ht for more than a few weeks, you'll prefer the way it is set up. a car or a bike steering is more sensitive at higher speeds, so to me it makes sense, but i might be out of touch since i'm 100 days in now.

cheers,
pt

http://www.bookofseg.com

[terryp]

It would make much more sense to me if the turning sensitivity didn't depend on the key but on the forward speed. Then maximum rotation of the grip at any forward speed wouldn't let you steer so fast as to be potentially dangerous. I'm sure that when you've got enough hours under your belt, you'll get used to anything, but this seems much more logical to me. BTW pt, I don't agree that a car's steering is more sensitive at higher speeds. The wheels turn the same amount, and the turning radius is the same, regardless of speed - at least on my car. ;)

[pt]

terryp-

the faster i go, the more control i want the human (not the computer) to have over turning. let's say i was going 12.5 and needed to steer away from something, i wouldn't want to have less of an ability to steer away because i was going faster. same thing with a car or a bike, i wouldn't want less control at higher speeds, only more. i suppose it might not be as safe in some cases, but overall i'd rather have me steer too fast and tumble than be forced to hit something because the computer said "don't steer"...that's just my guess. as you said, after enough hours you get used to anything.

cheers,
pt

http://www.bookofseg.com

[terryp]

Well, I'm sure that the designers are a lot brighter than I am, and must have thought this through, so there are probably good reasons for the way it is now. I'll let you know what they have to say.

[toybuilder]

When you're first learning how to glide on the HT for the first time, your body (brain) hasn't developed the right kinesthetics to smoothly control the HT with the steering grip, and to smoothly shift the weight with or against the platform as needed.

As you develop that skill and learn to not jerk the controls, you can graduate to the yellow key where the steering is much more responsive. The higher speed lets you spin yourself on the platform almost as fast as a person pivoting on his foot. The responsiveness allows the experienced rider to better manuever -- and that extra manueverability might be important in an emergency situation. Again, this assumes that the person has mastered the basics of gliding and shifting his weight.

After using the yellow key and you have developed almost a bond between the platform and your body, you can move to the red key where the platform is even more responsive to you. At the same time, you should have even better developed kinesthetics of how to turn the steering dial and to shift your body to effect the turn.

Me, personally, I'm starting to use the red key about 10% of the time; but I still feel better being on the yellow key because my steering commands are still not entirely smooth and natural. I do find, however, that I can't go back to the black key -- it's almost like the sensation you get flopped out on the couch after a long day of physical work -- you want to move your limbs, but they don't seem to respond!

http://www.pasadenasegway.com

[Peter iNova]

After gaining experience, I find that the habit I'm building accounts for the steering as is, but ever so often the quick turn potential of the red key gets in the way. The problem is, I think, that as you get used to a certain amount of finger twist, it sinks in. I welcome the rapid twist of the red key at slow speeds.

It makes doing near-running about faces possible and when followed by a rear roll out, looks a bit like a snow board turn.

I've thought about the idea of speed up = turning sharpness down, but that now becomes a function of gauging speed as you try to twist just the right amount to make the sort of turn you wish, and as speed changes, any locked position you are holding would then become a change in turn rate.

What might work best is a fixed logarithmic turn scaling on the red key. now the turn rate would match at any speed, but be kinder to your steering fingers for small amounts of turn.

-iNova
http://www.glidewalk.com